Faith, Fear, & Flat Earth

0:01 Because they have this bias to believe that they're somehow innately correct. Oh, so like people that go to really impressive fancy schools actually come out thinking they're less vulnerable to misinformation, which then makes them more vulnerable to, oh, 100% that that that's exactly how I say what you're saying, because they have a greater confidence in their own in that intellectual stack that lets them determine truth.

0:27 That's so. So are we, like, really well-served if we, like, kind of train kids to be really critical thinkers and also highly skeptical about everything. Would that be like a really good education path? I think so, and that's what we've talked about outrageously like logic, but combined with skepticism, logic and skepticism combined also with a healthy dose of what is the possible right.

0:51 Kind of like Occam's razor understanding, like, you know, the simple solutions or simple explanations are usually, you know, probabilistically most likely would be more accurate. But, I guess what I'm trying to say is layer on top of that, an idea of like a survey course, almost of what? What is the edge of what we can do.

1:11 Right. Like we're not going to be implanting cameras in your eyeballs because we fucking can't. Right, right right right. Yeah. Yeah. You know. Yeah. Like like okay. So like you wouldn't spend much time with birds aren't real because birds are real. Birds are real. First of all, like you've probably seen a dead one on the side of the, you know, at some point in various forms of decay throughout your life.

1:33 But if we decide that that needs to be a treatment, then we go in our biology class and we go birdwatching it. Well, I mean, you know, the complexity to make like a fully mechanical bird that would pass through the bird and have them be thousands and thousands, if not hundreds of thousands, if not millions of them widespread in every way possible.

1:56 It. Well, you know, I don't know what's possible on the cutting edge, but the to go to that length. Right for like to to do some kind of surveillance on people would be completely absurd when there's like thousands of other better ways like. Right. Easier, more simplified ways. They're harder to detect. Yes, yes. So in this case, all you'd have to do is just capture a bird and you'd have the most complicated machine.

2:21 You know, you'd have the technology of the FBI, CIA, whatever saying I'm saying. Right. And they're not going to want that. No, they're not going to want that. And like, this would be like the most cutting edge technology ever made. It would. And you look at previously released at least surveillance technology from the 40s, 5060s, you know, they had made mechanical things that look that were not even reasonable facsimiles of bugs.

2:52 Yeah, right. They're like art deco and like, you know. Yeah, all kinds of weirdness. Yeah, but they were nothing. And I'm sorry, they anybody who's taken a biology class knows we don't know enough to make a bird. So, so like, you know, people that kind of are in our social network kind of sphere of influence, we want to call it, 20 of those people actually consider the idea we're in a computer simulation.

3:21 Sure. That's fine. Why is that? You know, that should be just the same as the birds. Well, okay. It's another level because. All right, we can take we could capture a bird if we were. And if we really had to, we could dissect said bird to prove it was a wholly biological item. Sure. Right. We have any person has within the means of their own hands to say, prove Joe had a bird and prove it's not a robot.

3:54 Yeah, I'm not saying you should. Oh, so. So the computer simulation one has greater solvency or like, like, more possible credibility. Yeah, because it's harder to prove or disprove. Oh, well, then then then the God theory trumps everything. Because that's the hardest proof, right? Exactly. But the the whole idea that the people that claim that we're living in a computer simulation, I think of them the same as the people that are in the bird compartment department and the flat earthers.

4:24 There's absolutely no evidence of to think or to believe that we're in a computer simulation. There's no evidence whatsoever like I'm getting down to like, skepticism one on one. Right? And so there's evidence to believe. You don't believe that's called being a skeptic. Sure. So there's absolutely no evidence whatsoever, zero mill, that we're in a computer simulation. Yeah.

4:45 Okay. Well, wait, do you think I. I don't have it. Does anybody have any. I mean, of course not. Yeah. I you know, I've read a bunch of articles on it and they claim that there's, you know, oh, freedom free clickbait. My God. Yeah, yeah, yeah, but I haven't. I will if we've put it this way. I haven't run across anything that I can easily assimilate and understand and regurgitate.

5:13 That is evidence, because all those articles that I've kind of halfway skimmed over or it's. Yeah, yeah, they, they didn't seem to bring the, bring forth anything that was concrete. They just kind of were like, yeah, simulation, simulation, simulation fun, Yeah. Right. Right, right. See, flat earthers are like trying to trying to say, like, you know, do this experiment, you know, let's try to do this science to, you know, say the earth is flat.

5:41 Now that, you know, we laugh at them because, you know, we we know better. You know, we're we're not we're not complete scientific, you know, idiots. But at least they're like going after evidence, you know. Yeah. Well, you thought that guy that built his own rocket. Yeah, it crazy managed you fly this rocket several times and not die, then killed himself whenever he built the rocket that went the highest.

6:07 Wow. Oh, yeah. See, I know all that. That. That's fantastic. It was amazing. I will look it up and send it to you. But he managed to kill himself this last time, and he was like an a sick dude. I just hear, like, the song Rocket Man by Elton John playing him, like, right now. If if that doesn't exist with him doing that, we must make it.

6:29 Burn. And that his views on over the flat earth. Yeah. Infinite. But yeah, he was trying to, get high enough to see the curvature of the earth. So. So they hit the dome and died as I happened. He just went too damn high. It came down way too damn fast and died. Oh, the earth is in. And now he is here.

6:52 Yeah. Exactly. Well, I've had some dudes death, but still like us. The absurdity. Yeah. So, you know, the the thing is, he didn't have to die. That's why it's on it. He did it himself. So the the the flat earth people are like, you know, that have, you know, at least learned to read in their life or something like this, right.

7:12 At least have at least are trying to say some things that like, you know, can relate to, things that we know, like common sense stuff. Right. And then trying to extrapolate that into the macro, you know, like for example. Right. You know, you have to have a container to have pressurized air. And it was like there that.

7:30 Right. One of the things they'll say like, so if, if, if the outer space was a complete vacuum, as they say, right. And the Earth wasn't covered in a dome, right. You know, flat like a snow globe, you know, covered in dough. Yeah. Like, no, no snow globe. You know, whatever. A flat plane with a globe with a dome on it.

7:48 Right? With this big ice wall and all that. If that weren't the case, then the the the zero pressure of space would basically not suck. It. Put the pressure right. The pressure always moves from a higher pressure gradient to a lower pressure gradient. So their logic is that, you know, all the atmosphere would just just exhaust off in the space, you know, would blow off in the space.

8:13 Okay. Well, you know, to like someone that has very little understanding of science, you know, that's like, makes a lot of starts to make some sense. Know something that actually makes them this way. Yeah. So, I mean, I can explain that away very easily. Okay. Like me to go ahead and you can, because that's not the way the atmosphere works.

8:41 So go ahead. Sure. So, think of your nitrogen oxide. The, atmosphere is mostly nice. Yes. It is. Yes. So let's take a nice trace amounts of other things. Let's take a nitrogen molecule and like, imagine it's like, okay. And here it is out in space and it's just floating around. We have not seen you for many a day.

9:04 Can we'll do carpets. It's out here minding his own business right out in space, mining something there. It's like a carpet cleaning band. Which responsible? Yeah. Oh. Go ahead. And, that that molecule says, oh, shit. Gravity. Right. And so it starts moving in a certain direction. And then there's another like nitrogen atom somewhere or molecule floating around.

9:27 Right. It says oh yeah. Yeah. Gravity. Right. And it and so it has like a vector there's moving in a direction all right towards that center of gravity. And then joins up with other things that are pulled towards that center of gravity as well in this vacuum space. Yeah. Now water, liquid gas, everything else, all of this coalesces ro less than around the center of gravity.

9:50 Yes. And so as you get up higher and higher in the atmosphere of the are just thinner and thinner and thinner. And so then finally where there's just little air, we call it space, you know. So you're we're now in space, right? It's not like this definitive barrier, you know. Oh, it's a gradient. It's a transition. Yeah. It's a gradient.

10:05 So it goes to next to nothing to like. No, none at all. Not detectable by modern instrumentation. Right. And so if, if one of those particles starts to kind of move, move away from the Earth, the gravity pulls it back. And so that's why you have this gravity held in, you know, air pocket, you know, of gas around.

10:24 And it makes sense that gas would be, you know, on the outer edge because it's less dense, right? Yes. And, and, you know, history, you know, think about it. We've got the core of the earth, which is the in essence, the center of gravity is the greatest mass, right? And then we build out from there to less for further and further less dense items.

10:47 Right. So if you can slate the entire Earth to like a, pressurized can of tennis balls or something, then then all of a sudden this is the explanation of why the air is a dozen more satisfying. That sound. Sorry. Yeah, but but you see how you see how, like, the slightest thing, like a slightest gap in scientific knowledge or, you know, time to actually play something leads to a false belief.

11:11 Someone that's not trained in logic, it's skepticism, you know? Yeah. I guess I'm saying we need logic. Skepticism. And to train them in the art of the possible, we need to train them in the and in the kind of the, the a survey class of how does the world work. Right? Because the logic and skepticism give you some tools.

11:33 But you got to have the grist for the mill. You gotta have the something to work with, you know? Yeah. Yeah. So, you know, your every day class, you, I don't know, science class, you know, isn't going to go about that type of explanation like I just made, I guess, you know, it previously wasn't challenged with this idea that you're right in half to it just expected you to accept the basic tenets of science in our world.

12:03 Yeah. No. Here's the next one. Right. The next one is like this idea that. Oh, well, water always finds its level, you know? Yes. In a bathtub. Yeah. Dude. You know, in the simplest of systems. In containers. Sure. Yes. And in a test tube or, a small beaker, you can actually see, like the meniscus, you can see the surface tension.

12:23 You can do that in your own, in a in a cup on your, on your counter, you can see the meniscus. Right. And so in that context, you know, the water finds its own levels that center, in that case, the surface tension is causing a concavity. Right. So it would be like the opposite of the curve.

12:41 You know, the the claim is that the Earth is convex because it's round. Right? So the Flat-Earthers say, you know, these are people that are not scientifically, I don't know, attenuated or that scientifically literate, you know, purely scientifically literate. They would, you know, here, check this out. See how water always find this a level, you know, and so therefore you can't have water.

13:05 These big oceans like take up half the earth on a, on a round sphere. It doesn't happen. Water always finds a level, right? It's always flat. So. So therefore, you know, it's a big lie. The whole globe cards, you know. Yeah, we're globe tart. And so, you know, that's the same premise of gravity pulling everything towards the center point.

13:23 You know, of course you're going to have spherical water in that case right over the, over the, angular difference between one end to your bathtub to the other is so freaking small relative to the circumference of the earth, it's impossible to even detect any type of circumference there, right? You know, mathematically exist, but practically it wouldn't over such a small space.

13:45 You certainly aren't going to be able to perceive it with your own eyes. And then, you know, you won't even they'll perceive it with the most sophisticated instrumentation because you in. And here's the thing. Okay, yeah, modern instrumentation would fail here. Your own perception would fail here. And that's the thing. They have so much faith in their own perception.

14:04 What the instruments that we have are terrible, like the eyes that we have compared to other animals or shit. The, you know, and it's like other animals even have other senses, like a bird has, can sense the magnetic field of the earth and use it to migrate, you know, things like that. Yeah. So in that same vein, I saw just the other day a video talking about this cat that, our nose.

14:32 Right. Compared to cats or dogs. Sure. Yeah. You can, you can kind of just every, you know, measure the anatomy and see that there's, you know, magnitudes more olfactory nerves for the cat or dog, right, than the rest of the humans. And not even having to know anything beyond that, know that they can definitely smell better than us.

14:51 And then you have the anecdotal evidence of the, of the animal, the attractant sniffing stuff out. Right? Right, right. Yeah. So you put it all together and it's, you know, a strong case can be made. So there's where your skepticism doesn't have to work too hard. Right. Because there's all the data. There's all this evidence for you. Yeah.

15:09 Yeah. So like people in our kind of field and domain and our sphere of influence, you know, are mostly okay with the idea that, like, we're a computer simulation because that's kind of sounds cool. Well, it sounds cool and it plays into what we do as it nerds. It says, well, holy crap, it's the idea of, you know, the mythology prelates saying it's turtles all the way down.

15:33 Well, we're like, well, we're it nerds. It's it ovoid it. That's right, that's right. So there's a, there's a, a bias there. Right. Automatically we're, we're, we're, we're willing to accept stupid, dumb shit that's more in the domain that we're, you know, that we're used to in our field of interest. But what we should start doing to the people in, in our, you know, sphere of influence is say, yeah, we're just doing computer simulation is say, yeah, the Earth is flat, you dumb ass.

16:02 Right? Because in that same realm, there's if there's no evidence for it, then it falls to the same category. It does. It's in the same in some things here. If you don't let them affect your daily life can just be thought experiments. This could be one of those. Okay, same flat earth thing if you didn't let it affect your life.

16:22 Doesn't affect my life. I'm just saying that. But yeah, some of these people that the simulation people or the flat earthers, they let it. Oh, I've seen it. If they build their life around it. Yeah. I, I know a guy particularly who is a believer in flat earth and isn't that dumb of a guy, but he's built his life around this the this premise that it's true nonsense.

16:44 Right? And now he's had to say that NASA is a lie. And while you know all this, all this stuff is CGI and fake and it's a big conspiracy and he then Biden's all that to maintain the belief that the Earth is flat. Right, right. And then all these other things do like search and talk about the Bible and the firmament and all that, you know, here we go.

17:04 It's like a gateway drug to, you know, believe anything? No. You know, that's true with conspiracy theories. Is that once somebody, those actually fully full sail believe in a conspiracy, that it's easy to believe. Easier than the next one. Yeah. The odds that they're going to believe in and numerous conspiracies is actually goes up higher interest. And the more conspiracies you believe in, the more likely you are to believe any more.

17:28 So it's like a it is like almost like a feedback loop. Okay. So, the problem is, is that there's been some examples in history where, like everyone scoffed at the conspiracy theory, it turned out to be true. Yeah. And when that happens, that throws a monkey wrench into the whole skepticism of the whole thing is, well, it's all true because this one thing was or this one thing was partially true, and that's what it is.

17:55 The government lies all the time. And here's a whole host of examples that are documented historically. Accurate. Yeah. Is the government in a lie surveillance camp? Can point to some of the stuff that Edward Snowden unveiled, like in a catalog, which has some pretty cool stuff in it. You're right, you're right. And so those start those things used as the foundational anecdotal, you know, data points can then quickly erode a claim that skepticism is the right answer.

18:23 You know. So yeah. Well, while you're being all skeptical, you know, I'm going to stay away from all this stuff and not trust any not trust the government and not trust, you know, blah, blah, blah because of these examples like I'm talking about. And so next thing you know, the person's a flat earther and anti-vaxxer. Yeah. Well into the modern, modern pitfalls of modern AI.

18:47 And also there's got to be an element of wanting to belong to the group here. Always. That's always an element. Yeah. Yeah, that's always an element for sure. It's like once you fall in with that crowd like, whoa, what are these guys believe? Yeah. Especially when, like, the hot chick is in that group, right? Oh. Oh, my God, that makes sense.

19:08 We have salmon. You have to ask him about the flat earther hottie that he met in, Tennessee. I rest my case. Is it? Yeah. I mean, he basically agreed with her because she was hot. There was this philosophy group that. That, guy Bill, Vince Lee used to run, and he had a girl that was coming to his Sunday philosophy group, and we used to go to McCoys.

19:35 That bar on, whenever I'm on Woodlawn. Right. Okay. We used to go there as, like, an after party and hang out right for a while. Have an appetizer and a beer or whatever, and, carry on the conversation. And something was interesting that we talked about, you know, or. Yeah, it'd be like afterwards be like, hey, you go.

19:52 Course. Yeah, sure. I'll go there for a while, you know, hang out. Well, this girl who's like, I'm not going to lie pretty attractive, you know, and she's talking about Reiki. I mean, I'm seeing auras and oh, now, you know, on and on about this stuff. And I couldn't help myself, you know, I, I went ahead and, I don't know, there's a competition in my, in my, in my brain and in my psyche of like and in my physiology, right to like you might want to win favor by an attractive female.

20:28 Right? Right. Absolutely. In contrast with, I can't let this hit me and I can't let this go on any more of this nonsense. It's couple attractive, female, but also someone who has a little bit of social cachet and, you know, cow for sure. For sure, for sure. You're like, you don't want to upset the person who has climbed the ladder a little bit.

20:50 Yeah, right. And, you know, burn a possible bridge or. Yeah. I was not single time, so I'm not too worried about burning a possible, you know, dating relationship. Now, but still, there's like that between the sexes. Nuance, right? Yeah. You don't kind of want a, attractive girl to not like you. Yeah, right. Because what do you attract if this one attractive girl doesn't like you, maybe that spreads to other attractive girls.

21:18 Yeah. And as a, you know, and as I was sitting here, like, listening to her talk, I actually said that in my mind, I was like, if, if, if that was a dude saying those things, you would have verbally eviscerated him, right? Yeah, he would have been trash. He would never came back. And then I couldn't help myself and lock him out of my mouth.

21:37 Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I was talking about how full of shit. And, you know, all that stuff is clearly just, you know, just just ways to trick other people, right? Just a freaking magic trick at best. You know, it's right up there with palm reading and blah, blah, blah. And, you know, it's like reaching James Randi, the ultimate skeptic.

21:59 Yeah, we're both the shit out of your belief or those that have followed in his footsteps that are have specifically debunked. Yes. All Reiki. So. Right, right, right of people who are continuing to run his amazing nonprofit. Well, I cannot remember the name of it. Yeah. It's related to like the Skeptic Society time. Right where like that, you know, and they put put somebody that claims they can do all this stuff and you have people line up behind a small screen and you say, you know, that person had an aura that you can supposedly see through a screen that you claim it's.

22:31 And then you do it scientifically, fully randomized, double blind. And next thing you know, they're they're not doing better than chance. Yep. So if they can see an aura, they would, you know, be able to obviously see the person. Right. Go through the thin veiled screen. Yeah. Yep. And but they don't because there is no. And so yeah.

22:52 So like you just said a minute ago with, the human senses. Okay, so you're telling me is like some person, some some Reiki master, right? Can see an aura of somebody say, oh, your pituitary gland is off, you know, or whatever. Yeah. Right. Right. Oh, you might suffer from arthritis. You know, your aura suggests that there's a I see a little dip there around your side.

23:15 Your flank, you know, you know, you have chest pain before in your life. And talking to, like, some 54 year old overweight, you know. Yeah. And, you know, it's like stress way. Yeah. Yeah. You're talking to some guy who makes a crap ton of money dressed in a suit. You know, he's overweight. Got that? He's sweating across his brow.

23:36 He's eating fried food. Yeah. And loaded it up with salt. Yeah. And the Reiki master is like, yeah, I see an aura there that if he ever had just been. Let's look, I just had open heart surgery, you know? Yeah. Open heart surgery last week. Oh my God. And, you know, you know, my my Ed too.

23:55 Yeah. Yeah. That's like running joke. It's she's like, yes, I can see you. There's a void in your aura where you're where your dick is. Yeah, yeah. I knew that. So you know now come. Yes. Come in for a session. You know we can correct this. We can work on it. Yeah. Good work on your own. Your energy balance.

24:17 Yes, yes. Open up your chakras or whatever. Working on it now. He's no threat. He's like he's double. He's like the perfect candidate. Right? Because now he he's no threat because he can't get it up. And so yeah you're right. He's not going to be going after. And number two he felt heard. He's not understood. That's right. And so thereby he's more the more likely to accept.

24:39 Yeah. So somebody talked to him and took an interest in him I said that oh yeah. This is more than happens in the meetings. Yeah. So next thing you know the guy's like you know, opening up his wallet and has this crazy belief system now and balancing out his energies. Yep. When really he just needs to stop being the fucking fries.

25:00 Chicken finger. Right. We just stop going with the quick option at work. He's got 15 minutes to there. You know be step walk up. Yeah we're in his calendar and we dance out while on the treadmill. Whoa. Not to say I do that as much as I need to, but yeah. Oh, if probably 90% of adults don't do that like they, you know, do that like they need to.

25:24 But anyway, beside the point, the, you know, this, this kind of thing, you know, just repeats over and over and over. It's the same. There's just like, this is a cycle. It's whatever the next trend is of magical fairy dust, snake oil just it never ends. It just keeps going, right. It keeps going on and on. And those same people that are will fall for that will also toe the party line for the politics.

25:50 Yeah. And they'll also show up and make sure they put their tithing in every week. That situation is same type of psychology. It is, it is. And it all goes to it also. It all goes through acceptance. The individual wants to be accepted. The individual wants to feel a part of something greater than themselves. And they also want to feel like your reach is extended.

26:11 They want to feel like they have not only control, but they have power right there. Yeah, and all of that comes from a longing to these words. They're what I know something the rank and file. No, no, I understand a depth of the universe that you don’t. And to me that has never been said up. Yeah I have something you don't have and can't him.

26:37 Right. Like my my heart has been anointed and filled with the Holy Spirit. You know, only by getting on your knees and accepting Jesus, you know, asking Jesus, come to your heart. Yeah, right. There you go. Supplicating. You know, then you finally be like mouthing, scraping and yeah, sacrifice. Oh, sure. Get on your knees in a position of surrender.

26:55 Right? Right. With your hands up. Position of surrender. On your knees, down on the ground, in front of some other, some dude. But most likely a dude, right? That's up on a raised pedestal. Yeah, in some type of fancy garb. Right. You don't see the psychology in that. You're blind as high, you know, and submissive. And it is it's I mean, it's other things that the church it also don't other things that, you know, added to the submissive quote, component one was, I have to intercede on your behalf to God.

27:27 I have to talk to God for you. I'm praying for you. And then another thing, you confessed to me. Of course, there's going to be an intermediary, right? Because you have to pay me to. Yeah, you pay me, you confess to me. I pray for you. I can, I can get you. I can get your loved ones out of purgatory.

27:46 That's right. I convert that cash into, Jesus coin. Yeah. And you repay? You paid enough Jesus coin to get your grandmother so out of purgatory. Now she'll go to heaven. Oh, why? Didn't know about that. Oh, grandma. Yeah. Jesus. Why don't you tell me that earlier? I would have gone a long time ago, right? Or hell, grandma, I might have just left grandma at that and not paid the school.

28:14 But what if I paid the wrong denomination? No pun intended. Yeah, and then that sends her to hell. Oh. Oh. Yep. What a. Hey, you know what? If, I, you know, if I pay the Southern Baptist to get her out of purgatory and get her hair instead, I was supposed to pay the Catholics right? And, you know, like, does God convert this?

28:36 Does God say, well, we'll figure it out or, is is grandma just stuck in purgatory forever, or is it just somebody who could also buy indulgences at one point? You know about those? Oh, yeah, that I know that I that offer fucking terrible. And the purchasing the relics. Right. This is a piece of the true cross, right?

28:55 You can buy it. Yeah. Yeah, you can buy it. And they just broke up some furniture in the back. Eight shards. Yeah, right. They found some old chairs and, you know, tables and. Well, let's throw up in the back. Oh, look, if you don't want to buy it, I'll charge you a small amount to touch this relic. Yeah, with whatever you have on you.

29:12 Oh, you know the energy from here. You've got a chain. Oh, you can make that a third class relic by touching this first class relic. But you got to pay me money first. Yeah. So, like, you know, we should start making these relics, you know, like, put make, like, a micro version of a tens machine, a tens or tens machine that tenses up your muscles.

29:32 Right? So we're able to touch it. Yeah. Like it gets a static electricity from the air and perpetually, like, give you some muscle twitching. Yeah. If they do, you feel the energy will use some of those energy harvesting chips that. Yeah, you could, you know, basically the RF background radiation. Yes. And more. Exactly. And convert it into usable energy.

29:54 Yeah. Hell yeah. Like it takes like, am, you know, transmission. Yeah. Signals and conversions. Yeah. The low energy. Yeah. Right. So a little bit of DC current at the right frequency for like muscle contraction. Yeah. So people are like holding on to this, you know, divine right or whatever you call whatever you want. I love the idea of a divine rod.

30:13 Yeah or no. Hold on divining rod. But who use your kung fu grip on my divine rod? Please?

30:22 I like how you self indulge yourself by saying it's divine. Rod of God. Yeah, which is the Rod of God ministries. But you. Yeah. They're local right? Yeah. Rod of God Ministries on Tryon Street, right near Arrowhead. Yeah. And, they're just hilarious. Rod of God Ministries. If if some kid gets touched in that church and you didn't see that coming, didn't.

30:50 Something's not right. You missed the cue. You missed a you missed a little signal there. Yeah. You know, it's like I would met. They do have their own school where a level they have to be in the church to finally see the rod. Oh. Or to be, show it to use their nomenclature to be anointed by the rod of God, the anointed.

31:11 Yeah. Anointed. I love all these words. You know, there's there's, like, this small buffet banquet of words that are, like, very specific to, you know, all this ideology. Well, salvation and anointed and. Yeah, you know, a repent, repentant repent is a big one, right? Is a huge one. Oh, here we go on. Coming to, you know, having a contrite heart, you know, salvation.

31:40 Yeah. You know, I've been saved. Glory outside of morning glory, right? Right. And then that all ties into that's been appropriated by the nationalism crowd because you got God glory and guns. Nice, nice, nice. You know, their, their whole that's their whole thing. And so that ties back into this one powerhouse. There I saw a funny video where this guy was talking about different words, the silent k’s in varied forms like knife and knuckle.

32:17 Right. And, there is, there's some word that was two silent KS in the word. Really. I remember what it was a man had, but and then the joke was in then there's even words. There's even, a word with three silent KS in it. It's called Republican KKK. Where you go, That's too funny.

32:45 And he didn't even, like, spell out KKK. He just let he's just the other night. You let you figure it out? Yeah, yeah. He's like, there's even word with three out gets in it. Republican. It boom. Pretty funny. Yeah, I wish I had that kind of subtlety within me. I do not, yeah. The current thing is the CRT and like, you know, the grooming of young children and that's been that's one of the buzzwords, the signal words now.

33:08 And, you know, we're, I guess talking about Christian nationalism after all today. Right? You know, the, you know, there's this embedded language that's, you know, like so many other things, has its own embedded language. Well, yeah, I mean, everything does, everything does. Every insular group needs a shorthand to quickly communicate the concepts and ideas that they're building with and also signal that, I’m in this group, right at this particular, you know, section of this group, like in this case, it would be like the extreme right, you know.

33:38 Yeah, that these, dog whistles that as you will, words, you know, really say, look, I'm one of you. Yeah. That's signal, you know, anti-gay. I mean, see, all this, all the stuff that the far left is pushing the, you know, modern kind of, woke progressive, you know, front, kind of ultra extreme of the left.

34:01 I'm signaling now that I'm going to the ultra extreme, the right, but not want to look xenophobic and racist and religious and Zionist thinking. All is going to shift, even though that is, those are the very ideas and message you're espousing. Sure. But at the same time, you could argue and they do, that the far, left uses all these signals and words, and they do to groom the children, like getting the children to declare at a young age with their pronouns and, you know, hey, they're sexualizing the youth grooming that.

34:31 I mean, the I don't know, you and I have a difference of opinion here as to how much that actually happens. But on both sides then too. Right? Yeah. And and and ultimately, you know, all right. It's kind of hard because what we see are extreme examples. Those are the things that get put forth because they gain traction in our social media and our news.

34:53 All right. So I could I could like kind of make the case okay for white nationalism Christian white Christian nationalism very easily. Right. And first of all, it's going to be predicated on fear okay. So I'm going to start signaling all these fear terms. Like for example I'm going to make this projection. I'm going to say, oh, by 2050 white Americans will be in the minority, which is based well based on current trends of where population is going.

35:16 Right. But regardless, but let's let's say here's the math. Sure is ready. Okay. That the shows that white, you know, Americans would be in the minority by 2050. South Africa shows this. It doesn't matter if you're in the minority, if you just do a lot of power. Well, actually, South Africa reuses the fear because the the, the white people lost control.

35:41 There to the to the nonwhite majority. Right. Okay. So that would be adding to the fear. Now, you've relied on your traditional values through your church to and you feel like you're part of that community with the embedded Christian values, and you don't want this, this community, your people to be, be thrown because you feel like you are the chosen.

36:05 You are the you have the right morals. You are part of 144,000. That's going to heaven. Do you want to be literal? Yeah. Your morals are the correct one. And it's your ethical responsibility to to adhere to those morals and propagate them. Yeah. And not let anything erode those morals. Right, right. So there's that the fear of, of society at large chiseling into your morals.

36:25 Right, right. And not having the resolve or the fortitude to do what needs to be done. So make sure your ethics are enforced. Right? Like anti-abortion. So your ethic is right that abortion is is sinful and wrong and evil. Yeah. And so therefore, based on your moral values. And so it's your responsibility to find some way, whether there's anybody to get you some political angle and gerrymander and get the minority to become the, say, the land like vote in the Supreme Court.

36:58 Right. And I'm going to single vote issue my way. Right? I'm going to give everything to the rich just so I can have that one thing someday. Right. And so here we go down that spiral. So the Christian you know now or hey, you are rich and you use this powerful set of ideologies that a lot of people believe to maintain you being red, you become richer.

37:21 Absolutely. You take advantage of the single voter issue, and you get on the side of the single voter issue that's going to get you all those votes. Yes. And maintain your power, influence and cash. Your mistresses might have had 50 abortions in the time. It doesn't matter to you. You're just using that. You're saying you're anti-abortion just to get into.

37:37 That's right. It's it's the it's the cloak the wolf puts upon to be amongst the sheep. Right. And so then to get that in there, then say yes to letting the rich just keep carving up the resources for themselves more and more, right through a kleptocratic government, just to get just to get that moral value asserted through your ethic.

37:58 What's really is you're as a just when that ring hollow, you know, 100% rings hollow just like everything else in the same kind of domain. Yeah, rings totally hollow. I mean, like how how does that satisfy you? And oh, for goodness sake, how does that satisfy your God? Because you're so afraid that your morals are being eroded and that you're losing the control, the moral majority of the country by now there's gay marriage and now see the you gay pride phrase that are flaunting everywhere where you feel like your God is conferred upon you.

38:35 The responsibility of the morality of the country, the world, of course, of course. I mean, I've was raised in that. I still never I mean, I was right there were snake handler had snakes. So it's just a matter of like creating that, that, that, collection of fears. Okay. Yeah. And getting enough people in that, into that bag of fears one way or the other to then get the votes to then get the power.

39:02 Right. So it's about getting people in a state of heightened, I can fear and keeping them there. Right. So, like, you know, all these new green renewables and your family's been a coal miners for six generations. And so when you're in West Virginia and beating the storm, right, you got to look at it this way to your family may have been coal miners for six generations, but guess what?

39:25 They've also gotten black lung for six generations. That's right. And, you know, on top of that, you know how how tyrannical the, how are you doing? How the how tyrannical the, coal companies are and how they run the place, how they treat people, individuals like crap. So it's like, wouldn't you want to be under that yoke, rationally, in big picture.

39:47 Yes. But that's how you're put bread, you know, food on the table. So that's, that's your that's your shingle. You know, I will tell that using orders you that's your fear. My family was a coal family until just after World War two. And then we found other shit to do. But so. So there you have the picture, though, that I'm paying for this.

40:05 This resurgence of this white Christian nationalism, right? Is that this all these different fears, you know, they're they're they're they're things are changing too fast. You know, they're using this technology to censor you. Right? We've taken away our freedom of speech. Like, you know, Trump got kicked on Twitter is an example. Right. And you know, that's what these big tech.

40:25 But now he's got Truth Social which is going to just totally win the day. Right? Right. And so dude, it's a WordPress template. Then it's word for it of course. And the name is just so funny. Yeah. It's so the name is is outrageous. So in direct opposition to what he's plying spewing. So you can post anything you want on a, on a, on a network.

40:48 But the network itself is called true socialism. It's a silly. Yeah. You know, if it's called true social and you want to be the arbiters of truth, then there would be some sort of filtering, some wailing down, some reduction of things to make sure they're true. Wouldn't there be? I think that's in their user license agreement from what I think I read.

41:08 Oh, right. If they deem it to be a fault, they cut it. They they take it down. Right? Right. So you so, you know, of course, none of the statistics have been taken down here, which is hilarious, right? You know, talk about something with, that's truth tenuous about tenuous amounts of evidence. Yeah. So these fear things, like, you know, these, immigrants had thing going on.

41:33 I didn't I didn't even notice, sort of the same color as a shirt or Willie clothes. Nice. So, you know, these immigrants are coming over the border and they're taking all the blue collar jobs, the remaining blue collar jobs, which have already been pinched from, you know, manufacturing. And except they're not automated. We're, you know, right. It's you know, it doesn't.

41:52 And that's the fear. Right. And so now that's another one in this bag of fears to bring people into your ideology. Yeah. You know, come on. The the Christian church is the ultimate. You're going to go to fucking hell for all of eternity where you're tortured for all, until the end of time. So my own grandmother feels like she has to continually give of her meager resources.

42:18 She has to continually make herself available to people in every way, shape, and form because she's terrified of going to hell. Exactly. And I talked to her about this, you know, probably at least once a month. There you go. About how, you know, and I even use Bible quotes to talk to her about how she's lived a life of righteousness and openness.

42:40 And there's she's, you know, yeah. You never stop. You're never done with the race, per Paul. But but she can calm down. Keep doing what you're doing. Keep loving, keep caring, keep projecting that love of God into the world. But you're not going to hell. And she's. You don't need to pay to do that. You don't need to pay to do that.

43:01 Yeah, but but the still here it is. So it's caring to this fear always. It's back to the same thing. And don't think the left doesn't do the same thing as well. Right. It's like, you know, the left. We're creating these safe places. Right? Safe places where the kids can be who they really are. Because society and the evil.

43:19 I mean, I think Christians are trying to, you know, so you space idea is kind of B.S.. It's a false alarm, right? It's a it's another, you know, is trying to say we are a bastion of understanding. And whereas the rest of this world is evil and you must retreat from it. So maybe their ideology on the kids is creating an unsafe space to be.

43:39 But yeah, well, paranoia that they're in an unsafe space and the same way that we can so easily and clearly see how the fear mongering amongst the ultra far right and the, the, you know, the neo, you know, nationalist Christian nationalists, nationalists, let's be clear whether the fear monger is coming from the left or the right, the fear mongering is the wrong tool.

43:58 Fear, uncertainty and doubt are not a way to, in perpetuity, control all and increase our population's understanding and reach. It works great in the short term, but in the long term it burns people out and it leads to incredibly, energetic, dangerous situations. It does, it does. It creates powder kegs. It creates these highly pressurized situations that are going to detonate.

44:24 They're going to explode because people can't live under that pressure for and endlessly. Right, right. So that's exactly what you see. That's exactly what we're seeing. Okay. So you have this psychopathic okay, fear mongering society. Like here's an example. Your kid your kid has ADHD and so they'll never have a future okay. No no no. Think about this.

44:44 Your kid will never have a future because they can they're not successful in school because they can't sit still and concentrate. And if they can't sit still and concentrate in school, they'll never get into college and they'll never have a career. And it's a fear, right? It's another fear. And so let me get my kid then into this system of getting psychoactive drugs in their body when they're still developing.

45:03 Right. Totally reshaping parts of their brain for sure. Oh you know, okay. And then now they're set up for, for the future of like Ritalin and Prozac, lithium, all the other shit that Adderall all the other shit thats coming after that cocktail of drugs to stabilize this person. There you go. That is bestowed on our society at a rate that's tremendously magnitudes higher than the natural occurrences of genuine.

45:29 I mean, I see all sorts of messed up. Okay, but this isn't about you. I'm. No no no no no no, I'm saying I'm all sorts of messed up and I have yeah, have lots of problems concentrating things like that. But I personally have chosen let me build mental tools, let me build, you know, approaches. Let me build an understanding of how I work rather than rely on a cocktail of drugs that is is like a sledgehammer to your brain.

45:58 There you go. And so again, another fear driven right. Pharmaceutical industries is right. They're lining up to cash in on that fear. And so that is burning our society up saying same thing with like you just insert saying here and you can take it down the same pattern over and over and over again. All right. Yeah. So it's, it's it's just a form of marketing that's very clandestine.

46:21 You know, the fear mongering. Now you can even go I mean, I don't want to cherry pick the really the left or the right too much does. It's not fair. But the way I see it is this is this resurgence of Christian nationalism is, as you said, the powder keg, because not only are they so driven by fear, but they actually believe that God is on their side.

46:47 Right? When you have somebody, they're on a crusade. You have somebody that's afraid, is someone that's uncertain about the future. You're someone that's, self-esteem has been blown out of the water by that, by too much fear for too long in their in their mind and in their body because they don't feel like they have control or self control.

47:04 That's right. Yeah. Like I can't personally do anything, but guess who can? My God can. That's right. And then so you slip in that religious extremism then part as an the tail end and you have a terrorist. Yeah. Of a of a certain color. Right, a certain variety. Right, right, right. Because there are domestic and otherwise terrorists of every stripe.

47:24 Let's be clear. Right. So they're not flying, planes into buildings per se, but they might be trying to, they might be trying to infiltrate the military. Right. And they very well might be the intent to overthrow the capital. They might be trying to do something Waco ish where they're holding up and they're stockpiling weapons, and they're going to attempt some kind of two war secession.

47:47 They might think it's completely okay to get armed and go storming the Capitol. Yeah. Oh, shoot, that happened in it. Oh my God, look at this. I don't know, like, oh I rest my case. Right. And so the, the the reason that the, you know, kind of the Christian nationalism is so much more dangerous than the margins of the left pushing extreme wokeism unconscious bias in our, you know, fucking corporations.

48:14 I won't get the and the safe spaces in the schools. I look at all that is eventually just something that's going to wind down. And ultimately as kids navigate that and deal with that, they're learning what extremism looks like. And that's a good thing because later in life they're able to more avoid it, understand it and handle it because they're always going to deal with extreme.

48:34 I already see the pronoun thing waning. Like I really see that starting to tail off. Yeah, I see that less and less now we have, you know, rather than working ourselves up to a froth about it, you know, because it doesn't have the religious ideology and so much it doesn't have that strong power. Right? Like religious based things do.

48:54 Right? It's it's still has a lot of fear driven in a lot of, you know, very deep seated, opinion driven behavior and a lot of the things behind it. I do agree with it, but the people don't believe that God's telling to do it. Right. They they're trying to come up with a solution to a set of problems.

49:10 And in my opinion, it's not a very good solution. And it might not even be a very well defined set of problems. Is true. True. It might, you know, you might be sensing something wrong and then inventing problems to pin it on. There we go, there we go. And then and then in the course of inventing those problems, you create some discord that's not healthy for society and you create a half assed solution.

49:35 Well, like you said, society will kind of like sort that out over time. It'll it'll keep, you know, it'll meander, but it'll get to some destination, right? Yeah. It'll kind of keep course dragging. But when you have like the eternal soul on the line, it's different. That's something totally different. And these people will take this country down. They will, they will they will literally create a revolution in this country.

49:57 A fucking revolution. I mean, it's like that show, it's like the book or show Handmaid's Tale. It really is. It's that showcases the what happens when the extreme maintains power. Yep. And you realize the religious extreme and you light that fuze on that powder keg as you describe it, you light the fuze with extreme, left wing wokeism.

50:21 Okay. Right. That is lighting the fucking fuze. Right. And so the people that are on the far left extreme, okay, pushing this like free, like really, aggressive, aggressive ideology in the schools, trying to get grade school, you know, books where they talk about my two dads and all this shit. Then we have the opposite. They just got prayer firmly entrenched in schools from the right.

50:44 Right. Because that's a that's a reverberation from what the left is far left is doing trying to get these to these kids. Yeah. And the problem is, is that the, the, the short sightedness of the, of the far left is that they're going to lose to the, to the, motivation of someone that feels like they're inspired by God, because the person that feels like they're inspired by God will go beyond themselves to see to it that that that agenda is then met now to right again out of fear.

51:14 They're contaminating the kids, they're converting. The kids are grooming the kids. Right. And so that's why the, the, these this new Christian nationalism is using those signal words to stoke, keep stoking that fear which then is power. And that's one thing we have to be careful of. You know, when we if we talk about CRT and give it any kind of credence, you have to really understand where the whole motivation of them appropriating CRT is, is from.

51:38 Exactly. And we have to understand that really it's probably a misappropriation and that it really isn't happening to the degree that these people are saying it's happening. That's right. That's why special interest groups shouldn't be running the agenda in schools. There should be academic focus groups on what works in education coming forward and saying, this is what the kids need to be successful learners.

52:00 And that power base has been eroded by the fact that states, for some reason, just don't want to pay a teacher for sure. And, you know, there's all these like they attack their retirement and everything. But go ahead. You know an education is particular, right? Expectation is huge. But like almost every kid has a, you know, an individualized education plan, right?

52:20 Yes. And so perfect world. So every teacher looks at that, looks at that IEP to know what the deficiencies are of that particular child and then mentally pigeonholes them for their expectation. Sure, sure. Now I'm not going to get into the debate on the IEP, but like that's just one negative aspect of it right? Right. And then you've pile on top of that all these special interest groups coming in from the outside wanting to push an agenda in the school.

52:46 Yeah. Okay. And then the teachers are like the front line, you know, interface of all that shit. And God forbid, you know, the teacher just does something natural and just like, is themselves in the classroom. Yeah. Okay. Their turn to. Do it was like a quarter mile away. Yeah. But anyway, they're the fast and heavy.

53:17 They're made of a gummy like material. So, Seriously. The teacher then becomes this, like, ground zero for this culture war. You know, the school becomes ground zero for the culture war. And that's the last place we need. The culture war. Yeah, we need schools. Need to be divorced of that. Schools need to be a place where I imagine something along the Library of Alexandria, where we catalog and collect the information of the world, where it's presented, preserved and, you know, propagated rather than debated endlessly upon.

53:56 It's, you know, and all because that's, that's what we're doing in so many states like Texas is depending upon fact here and saying whether or not we can teach certain things. So the Christian nationals are going to say, look what they're trying to do to our kids in school. They're trying to create the safe spaces. They're trying to get them to talk about their sexuality at a young age, the grooming them with all this, like trying to get in there attacking our religion by talking about, you know, evolution.

54:23 Exactly. You're telling our kids, I think that that that they came from monkeys, you know, which, of course, isn't what revolution says at all. Not at all, you know, but they're trying to teach our kids that there's like, there's nothing special about them. They're just another ape. They always are because they are. It's fine. You know, there is something special about humans, but but they yes, there is a special ingredient, one we can sweat to.

54:45 It's goes way beyond just physical things. Well, yes. Two, we have larger brains and, we have a, we have that nice thick corpus callosum to shove information between the two hemispheres, you can say like the, the bottleneck dolphin or the, this, certain type of whale like, has way, way more neuro connections and than humans do, like you can find in, in the animal kingdom, biologically speaking, superior species in every domain, every every aspect of human.

55:13 So you can't physiology biologically make humans special in the in the domain of biological. Well, I, I'd argue the big thing is our level of social organization. That's that's one of the huge things. And so you can't just take him beings and divorce them of technology and civilization and culture and language know our those are the things that we've built and that are ingrained in us.

55:36 That's where art shows what makes us special. That makes us a different thing, right? Yeah. I mean, you know, sure. A, a corvid, Raven can use some tools, you know, and it can build tools, but it and it has rudimentary social organization. But we've taken all of those paws today. I make a laptop bitch.

55:55 Right? We've taken all these positives, and we brought them to the nth degree. Mean. But there is this this idea of like conflating humans with with just another quote unquote great apes. But I think we, you know, there's a negative aspect. I think we need to take that in and see it for what it is and what we are a great ape.

56:15 So so here's again, like how you can just abstract something, play into fears, okay. And stir up these deep seated, cultural, appetites. But I also don't like offense to being called a just another great ape, because in one last thing that I think you should add one aspect we are though genetically, we're so darn similar to these guys.

56:35 What is what is okay. Just without any. And that's exactly you. Titan perfectly was going to say, just take your fundamental take all your science brain and put it away for a night for a second. Okay? Yeah. You just know you have to intuitively, automatically with your gut that that human beings are not like any other animal and plant.

56:56 Well, yeah. Just looking at the Dominion we have over the other animals and how how many of them we've managed to make extinct through our own processes and choices. Yeah, yeah. But guess what? They'd make us extinct. Two animals have made animal other animals extinct through all fucking creation. Well, I grant hater, I agree with you, but nothing else has to that we've been able to record or recognize other than the extinction level events like a meteorite.

57:22 So a level that we have when, when victory entered extinction level events, when photosynthesis evolved in single celled organisms, single celled bacteria, cyanobacteria, when photosynthesis. Right. Came through the process of evolution. When photosynthesis arrived on the scene, I got it was the largest global sanction this world has ever seen. Right. Because it crowded cyanobacteria, crowded things out because they were able to more efficiently grab the resources.

57:47 Then the things that came before. Oxygen as an oxidizing agent is a is a basically a sterilizer. It's a poison. Oxygen is a poison for. So when oxygen was produced, it killed a lot of things off that were used to an anaerobic environment. Yes. Now, that was your largest extinction of one species. Extinction another ever in the known geological.

58:06 There we go. Okay. But human beings just being the dominant species is like. And other things going extinct. I'm not just going to say is great is good, right. But I'm going to point out this is a natural process, is a natural process. It's been exacerbated and accelerated by our choices. And we have to make more careful choices and be better stewards.

58:25 Like, okay, just like the Christian, right? They believe that they have been conferred responsibility for the world, animals, the earth. Okay, my God, we got to save the fucking red ass baboon. Okay. Yeah, but how many fucking derivatives of baboons and chimpanzees and apes species along the known record are long fucking years. The hundreds and thousands. Millions. Because it's so damn complex.

58:50 We don't understand it. We understand simple, complex systems. So we have to save the elements of it, because, all right, as a system breaks down, there are compensating pathways that can, you know, pick up the slack. But if you get too many of those pathways dead and gone, it can't compensate. So give me an example. You know, I'm just really talking about the ecosystem at large.

59:15 Like, an example would be, I guess, a particular plant or that, you know, a number of things depend on, say we use a, a pesticide or something that inadvertently kills it. Then all the things that depend on that, I have to find another pathway. Yeah. You're talking about, you know, biodiversity being caught in for an ecosystem has to be healthy.

59:42 But it might not be the case. What do you mean, it's not the case? What would it not be the case? It sure sounds correct. How would it not be the case? Look at the biodiversity we have here for this ecosystem we're walking through right now. There's people that live inside the inner inner city and never leave it their whole life and hardly ever see a fucking plant and even less wow, animal.

1:00:07 And they seem to make a life out of it. But then there are other places that grow the food, that bring the things, or that create the chemicals that you know they eat. Whatever. But we understand the chemistry of all these things happen outside of that person, and there has to be an ecosystem or some sort of complex system to support that.

1:00:28 The urban dweller, perhaps, perhaps or perhaps not. That's what I'm saying, is that the jury's not in on that, because there's a lot of people that have made all these claims, like, you know, Einstein, it's the bees are gone. Then, you know, we're we're doomed. We're next. Yeah. And like I'm saying, why doesn't that feature maybe there's compensating pathways, you know, hey, flies can pollinate things.

1:00:47 Other things support anything. But they're not there. Maybe. No. They'll pollinate them to the same level of efficiency. Perhaps not. Perhaps not. And they're you know, when we have to look at those ecological niches. Hey, maybe the bee did have evolved to be a very efficient pollinator, and maybe that's why we need them. Yeah. And maybe we can just genetically engineered plant that doesn't need to be pollinated to propagate.

1:01:07 And then will only do that for the handful of things we really care about. And then the rest of the biodiversity, right, may fall away. Right? It could be detrimental to us because we don't understand this complex system enough to really muck with it, but we have to come up with it because we live in. Right. So not understanding a complex system is not justification for doing anything for or saying preserve the system so that we have time for one to understand it to to gain not, you know, understand and gain knowledge from it, but also to, to allow itself to support us like it did before we started messing with it.

1:01:43 So it has to support us better now than it ever has. Has. And why? Because our carrying capacity has been increased through our engineering and so why not? Science and technology? Engineering help preserve these compensating past these, these, elements of the ecosystem that we do understand enough to preserve. Let's preserve them. Yeah. But what I'm saying, Sean, is that by not preserving it, we've created the maximum.

1:02:06 We've created the highest productivity the world has ever seen. We have by ignoring one thing. But now we have this high productivity and capacity that we can apply to preserving one of the things that got us here. Now we can make an argument that, you know, yes, we but we might be on the highway to hell like this increase in productivity through, you know, fertilizers and modern, you know, the agro agro techniques and whatnot.

1:02:30 Right. Might actually be collapsing biodiversity and and we're still in the sweet spot where it hasn't hit so hard yet. That is not cutting into the productivity. And let's be real, human beings are wholly reactionary whenever it comes to these big picture things. Right? But again, that's a that's a for all intents and purposes, we see more technology applied to agriculture.

1:02:50 We see greater productivity, greater yields, higher carrying capacity. And again, that's the swath of the plants we care about. But then we could be killing lots of other things like DDT killed, made partial soft and thereby yeah. And then there's that Silent Spring book and we adapted. We we changed the formula because we didn't want to have no birds.

1:03:12 Because we like birds. Yeah, well, we nothing. We like birds. Not only we didn't like birds. And that's great. That's great. Yeah, yeah. If we didn't like the sound of the noise, then we may have just left that part of the ecosystem die off, and we could have even a more dire consequences. We could say, hey, that was just a nice secondary benefit of the DDT.

1:03:29 Not only did it get rid of the insects, but it got rid of those fucking birds to the razor and bald eagles. No, not the body. Not those. All the other birds. But wait, the bald eagle. That's a symbol of our country, son. That's right, that's right. We can't get rid of that bald. It was about to be a turkey.

1:03:49 It really was down. It's so much better. No, no, look, it would have been apropos. Some kind of nasty fucking turkey vulture. Some fucking filthy eating rat, you know, disgusting thing that, like, sticks his head deep inside of a carcass. You see the skin of the carcass, the height of the carcass, like flapping as it's in there, like more on a piece of meat.

1:04:07 That should be. That should be the symbol of our country, aren't we? Are the. We are the carrion eaters. RNC yeah, carrion. Yeah, we will, we will, we will drive forward no matter how bad shit is. We'll start going to eat, motherfucker. Yeah, yeah. Roadkill. So like we have another example, right? So, like, you know, big collateral, secondary effect of automobiles.

1:04:34 Now people get hit by them, bicycle riders get hit by animals, get hit by animals, get crushed by them all the time. Right? People die in all kinds of car wrecks, etc., etc., etc., right? But yet we keep pushing forward because we don't want to give up the mobility that cars that seem to offer the majority. Right? So that's, that's why this thing with like the ecosystem system collapse.

1:05:01 Damn right. We should be careful, right? Damn right. We should be studying it along the way. Yes. You know, but also come to the fitness system that we've relied on and we're part of continually. Then we need to be careful of it. But we have to tip our hat to the to the reality that people want to eat their steaks.

1:05:19 Right. And that people don't want to pay a lot for organically grown, you know, what we have to accept, etc., etc., etc.. Yeah. And so you have to try to balance right the reality well with the idea. Right? Right. You know, that's true with almost everything life. It is it is ultimately you have to say, look, these are my constraints, right?

1:05:40 Right. This is the society within which I'm working. Right? Or this is the team in which I'm working, like right now at work, we've got some people who I've not bought into the doctrine of automation. Do not I do not feel that the promise of it is is great. And a lot of that comes out of naivete. Right?

1:06:00 Yeah. So some magic I plan to okay, do some education. And I also plan to do some demonstration like, hey, you know, that pain point you had that you just thought you had to deal with and you had to make a document about how much it sucked and how to do it. Right. It's gone now. So why is the corporation spending time getting people in classrooms, talking about their unconscious bias and their hidden racism in there?

1:06:21 All this stuff, right. I would argue on one front, one. Well, I, I didn't finish the sentence. Yeah. Oh, sorry. So you didn't get my question. So company is spending all this time and effort money energy right. Getting their people together which is really expensive because you're hiring outside consultant. That's expensive. Right. You're taking the time of your employees, which is you're paying them all, which is expensive.

1:06:40 It's like money. They offer us a disclaimer when they offer these things like a, like a meditation wind down on Friday afternoon. They're like, this shouldn't be done on work time. It's like you to it to thought, you know. Yeah, that that ties in. You're like, you're just hitting it perfect today. Like you're saying into my next comment, like, yeah.

1:06:59 Oh, and here's the garbage truck I got restock here. We have we've rediscovered our connection with the garbage trucks. And a second one, sir. Yeah, we we we didn't do this on purpose or that skill. Yeah. So anyway, they spend all this time, effort, money and energy on this, thing, right? And no real true way to measure the results from it.

1:07:25 Okay, there's. But maybe there's, like, exit surveys, you know, do you feel more enlightened by, you know, blah, blah, blah, which I can tell you, Wells Fargo employees know. And everybody that just want to do the training is going to say yes, because they don't want to flag themselves. And in anything where they enjoyed the 15 minutes of not working any right.

1:07:42 And that's that's not a question that's going to be on there. And you can tell somebody their, their survey questions or they're, you know, whatever their annual this or whatever is anonymous and nobody's gonna ever believe that. Right. And so you toe the line, they that's so funny. I took a right thinking that we might avoid it because the other one went the other way.

1:08:06 Yeah. Yeah. Anyway, so no one's going to answer it like that. Everyone has this at least some degree of, like, you know, this might affect me. So they're going to say what they know they need to say. Yeah. All right. So anyway, so still no real measurable. You know you're not get if you create a survey and people fail and you actually get results for that survey, you have to understand those results are not true.

1:08:30 Now take right. You bet. Take all that time and energy and effort and put it into a rock solid, scientifically based predicated. And here's the data, here's the literature. And here's your guide on why veganism is so healthy for you. Okay. And say that this company is working to subsidize a plant based lifestyle okay. Okay. Well hey the science they can do that later.

1:08:56 Once for me five days a week. That is legal. So then you can leave and get a hamburger. So now you're full, but now you can just go home and save money, because then you just get one hamburger on the way. Hey, cater to decent lunch for me. That was vegan. I did it and I'd stay with her.

1:09:12 Well, so I'm saying that if you expose rational people that are have a reasonably decent IQ to a solid set of information, and you put the corporate weight behind it, right? No pun intended. Right? You you put the corporate power behind it, in the life of the individual, and all of a sudden you can start to affect real social change.

1:09:31 And I'm just saying one of the ways you do that is make it easy for me. Cater my lunch. Farrell. Man. They make it a benefit. Yeah, it's like a benefit. And that's what, and I, they offset summers old son. I mean, that's what they do for them. They want them to be healthier, and they're constantly putting forth all these healthy practices.

1:09:49 And what they do is they offer healthy snacks and healthy things there and healthy catering to facilitate all that. Yeah. And so they thereby changing the health outcome, health disposition of the employees, thereby saving a tremendous amount of money on the health care package. Well, yeah, they save on the health care package and because they're using less disease.

1:10:12 Yeah. And on top of that they also as a side effect probably increase productivity and also loyalty. They give you a stipend for your own home garden, you know, up to a certain amount each year annually to enhance your home guard. And then people would go and take that stipend, put it all into their garden, take a picture, put it on their social media, and they'd put their own money into it.

1:10:32 Right, because they want to have the best one. Yeah. And you started this competition in Essex. Best urban garden. Yeah. Now, you know, you take and the details of that and driving that is up for debate. But you could pull it off. Yeah. Right. You could pull it off. But instead here we go back to the nationalism, the, Christian nationalism debate.

1:10:55 Right. Is that, you know, a lot of these companies, you have leadership that's very far left leaning. Okay. So what they do is instead of putting in a good nutrition program, I think they can dream up winning one academic integration program. Now, liberals are just as fat as Republicans, and Democrats are just fat as a problem. I'm saying if you're more liberal, aren't you more inclined to, you know, be vegan and be like, you know, have a have a rescue pet.

1:11:25 Yeah, yeah. From what? Yeah. So I'm saying if you're really if you're giving lip service to those things, then. Yeah, you won't have the progress. But if you do adhere to this like you push for those sort of programs, I would rank you things. Right. But when it comes to your selection choice of which program you want to put in, it's irresistible to put in the, you know, ultra woke, you know, you're going to have unconscious bias, you pig races.

1:11:57 You know, that's that's irresistible. You know, to to that crowd. You know that that that are pulling those strings. Yeah. And so now you have another conduit okay. So the preponderance of the media, the preponderance of the school, the College of Education, okay. Percolating down into the lower ranks of education, okay. The media in general, in general. Okay.

1:12:24 Newspapers, media across the board, social media as well. Okay. And your corporate leaders, especially in tech, are all driven by by very left wing people, all of that shit, all those little agendas, all those little programs, everyone's little, little agenda. Okay. Getting push, push, push, push, push is what creates and expand lives close to that stop sign. That's what creates expand own powers.

1:12:57 Oh, they do on that. Oh. That's that's an important point. All those things combined, right. Scare the shit out of people that want to stay in their own traditional Christian culture. Right? Right. They feel they're so they're attacked, assailed by them. They're constantly that is, their power base is being eroded. And I feel attacked by you. If I'm sitting in a class with my peers and somebody comes in and tells me have unconscious bias, I tell them, speak for yourself.

1:13:30 You have unconscious bias. Yeah, tell me what I have. Who the fuck are you? I mean, I get I get where you're coming from. Oh, we all have unconscious bias. Okay, but speak for yourself. Speak for yourself. I mean, Chris, it comes down to just like whenever you start out examining your own, productivity and your own use of your time, there were things you did not understand until you examined them.

1:13:53 Very true. It's the same thing. True. But who did it? Who was in control of that system? Well, yes. There wasn't somebody coming to me and saying, look, Chris, you don't use your time. Well, sure. Okay. But so we have to do this exercise now. I'm not a fucking child. But what I'm trying to say is you might benefit going through that exercise in the same way you benefited from formulating your own test of how efficient you were.

1:14:20 Okay, give me the tool. Give me the tool set. Okay. Give me the means and let you decide to apply it. Then we go ahead and reconstruct your idea of let me create a utopian where I tell everybody what to do now, but I'm not. I'm not trying to create a utopian work. Tell everyone what to do. You were saying you wanted to create a utopia where you gave people with only these healthy choices, and everything was cordoned off, and they were away from society where they did dumb shit.

1:14:46 Now, so what I'm talking about is turning the technology tools that exists, on their head, instead of using them to gain information about somebody and then using that information to advertise to them mostly. Yeah. And then enrich yourself by that information. Right. Turn that around. Enrich and empower and enable the person with the knowledge of yeah, guess who they are.

1:15:06 So where they are, give them tools and let them choose to use them or not. Right. Let me uncover my unconscious bias. Let not not some consultant me and let me decide whether or not I want to be vegan or let me decide whether or not I want to do these. Sounds right solutely. Absolutely. So the company comes in and it shows the science.

1:15:24 That's why I said science, right? Somebody comes in and shows the science, and then the people choose. So it all comes down to, using these social media channels appropriately, empowering the individual and educating the individual. Okay. Show me the science of unconscious bias. Dude, I was saying it's so easy to make my point. All I'm saying is you are.

1:15:44 You have that example there of once you examined your own practices, you realized there were some things you didn't know that wasn't they weren't correct. It wasn't unconscious. It became known. It became conscious. When you found out the facts, it was unconscious. Okay. So because you had thought you were doing this thing and you were doing something different, now it's not because, see, in the meta, I understand that I didn't have a strong command over the information, so I need to measure it in order to get that stronger command over the information, because I could tell from from evidence from from data, from things that I'm not getting very much done as you'd like.

1:16:15 You done. Exactly. So I'm like, I must not be thinking of my time, right? So I had reason to believe that I had some type of thing going on that I didn't quite get to say whether or not it's things you had the impetus to examine or not. If there are any major facet of your life, if you were to examine it with tools to measure, then you would come across insights and things you did not realize, which I like to.

1:16:43 That blanket statement is absolutely undeniable. 100% I agree. And so I'm going to that's it in general. But then when we apply it to one specific thing, you object to it. And I don't understand why you object because I don't I see the science and data backing what this person's claiming. That's so simple, Sean. It's like so stupid.

1:17:02 Simple. The veganism thing, right? It's like when someone comes and presents the science, okay? The science is very good. It's data driven. It's based on lots of information, lots of data that you didn't analyze on this healthier being a vegan. Yeah. Correct. And then you can still choose with that information to say I just prefer the cultural norm of, you know, a high meat diet and I'm going to suffer the health consequences that are now pretty well known, right?

1:17:28 Right. It's just like and choosing to smoke or not. That's right. And you can also choose to be a racist. You're trying to be a racist current and suffer. The downside is that you can't. I think that this is somebody you could. This is trying to get people to explore that. Maybe they're more of a racist current on the spectrum than they'd like to be.

1:17:48 That's what this is trying to do. Okay, that is totally legit to come at a group of people with statistics backing up how there's systemic racism in our country. Okay, 100%. There's inmates of information. This movement is trying to get them to examine that. Okay. But you don't have to come in and say you are part of the problem because of your unconscious bias.

1:18:11 When you have no idea how much unconscious bias I have, you have no way of rising me. You've just said blanket statement and they the reason they've said it that way is again, it comes in the fear pool. I can't be that way. Comes into fear. That's right. And now here's my card. Please refer me to the next corporate meeting.

1:18:28 And the thing is, I bet I see on the face of it. So the examination of your bias isn't a bad thing. Now, maybe the way that it's getting pressed upon you is maybe that the people continuously thinking about race all the time and having come through the media and all these different channels of these ultra liberal left wing channels constantly talking about race to everybody is making fucking racism.

1:18:55 I mean, it's definitely propping you out of where ever thought about that one? It's rubbing it up to some degree. But when you frame everything in terms of race, you're going to think about race much more and you become a race that gives strength to the society we're in. Okay, we all agree racism is a societal construct. Our race and racism are inside all constructs.

1:19:13 That's right. Now there is no such thing as race. We are all the same species. We can have sex with each other and produce. You bet. So that's the science. So, so that's a good starting point in this conversation. Yeah. And ultimately that's where. So okay. Present that, present that. Right. I don't know, sir. Talk. Okay.

1:19:36 So you present that, you show that you make the statistical like actual scientific case for systemic racism, how it exists in our society. Right? You bring up how the news bifurcates and the government, you bifurcates everything on race. They talk, everything is talked about. Everything provided upon race lines because it's convenient to do so, because race lines are a convenient proxy for socioeconomic strata.

1:20:00 Because you're right, you know, I mean, you're right. And so we need to stop doing that. We need to say poor people. Yes. Because guess what? The poor people actually are majority white. There's more numerical poor people that are white, I can attest than there are any other writings from rural Kentucky. And so to my girlfriends are the same.

1:20:18 But yet to feel better about yourself if you're a white person, society is has somehow construed it to where poor is conflated with being black and in in the Hispanic, in the ghetto, whatever. Right? Whatever. What's the name of the what's the name of a collection of redneck chanties? What's that? What's that called? See, we call it ghetto when we're talking about black people that are poor, living in proximity, each other.

1:20:39 Right. What's the what's the term for when it's like a back country, you know, I don't even know. I'd say a holler. I try their part. A fish concert, I don't know, a Burning man, you know, I don't. Well, those are people of a different sensibility who, you know, I not just mean just. Right. Yeah, but. So the whole thing about the unconscious bias in the whole thing, I do see a thread of where there's some good sensibilities and some good motives.

1:21:05 Yeah. And that's what if fear not. If it's not scientifically, if it's not backed by science and data and rationality, okay, then it's putting people in a bad situation. So let's not throw the baby out with the bathwater and take the good things and then back them, I drive them. I thought we were doing that. I thought we were just doing that.

1:21:23 We're saying, okay, let's start with, yeah, let's start with these premises. Right? Right. And say what we're trying to do is get people to be more mindful about some, some ideas that have kind of been ingrained in this, your society and the way society and start to think beyond that. And we're going to unearth and uncover more the more we examine things with the correct set of tools.

1:21:43 That's how we and so I'm, I'm saying straight up, these are clearly not the, the right set of tools because they're not predicated on science and data and they're not producing. And there you go. That too. They're abusing that. That's the thing. If they were the right set of tools and the right set of processes, or at least close to them, that we could continue to refine because we're never going to have the right set, but we're on the right track.

1:22:04 We're going to be producing more data, more to the positive, to the negative. That's right. What's killing? What's killing black and white people. And every however you want to divide people up, man and woman, whatever kind of, you know, way you want to classify people. And we have West five people were human, you know, what were you do that you go ahead and make those categories.

1:22:20 But then you look overarching and you say, what's killing us? Diabetes and heart disease. Yep. Okay. So the fucking corporation all the way down to the media and all the way down to the government should all be talking about that and talking about your unconscious bias to pick up the fucking hamburger, not your unconscious bias that you're a racist, racist, fucking asshole bigot.

1:22:41 Be kind and you should be ashamed of yourself. So if we fix if we look at things in the totality, like you said, look at what what affects us all rather than what divides us, what affects us because what affects us is what can potentially unite us. And so if we all say we're in the same boat, the same things are happening to us then and we are working together, this single minded thrust to fix it,

1:23:10 Then yeah, we fix the other problems too, right? So someone comes in. This is why I take reservations. Someone comes in and says, oh, you right there. White guy, 48 years old, about before nine years old. Pigeonhole me. Right? You're you're you've been absorbed the diet your whole life of racism. And you have unconscious bias all throughout you.

1:23:30 You just don't even realize that we're going to help uncover some of that. Okay. Yeah. I don't want to say fuck you. Speak for yourself. You don't know the first goddamn thing about me, right? Or a child goes to a all almost all black school. Yeah. White kid goes to where? He's an immersion school. Immersion school where he's dramatically in the minority.

1:23:49 Yeah, they call him cracker and white bitch. All the time. And I have to deal with that. I have to mitigate that for him. Okay? He does not say anything back in racially motivated or anything. I constantly am explaining in terms he can understand that it's just something that it's a passing phase. And every all these kids are going to grow out of it and you know, etc., etc., right?

1:24:09 Right. A majority of my fucking charity efforts that I put so much of my fucking heart and soul into actually services people that are considered minorities. Yeah. Okay. Every day I'm doing something that is is working towards helping people and they just happen to be in the majority minority. Yeah. Okay. Fuck you that you have the fucking racist, unconscious bias motherfucker, right.

1:24:33 What are you doing? Yeah. You're coming around spending more ideas about race. I'm doing everything I can to not spread ideas. And that's the thing I in. That's I, I agree, I feel like it's the wrong approach and it's the wrong set of tools and, but I feel like we can benefit from critical examination. We can't. We always can.

1:24:52 It's always valid to critically analyze, but don't come in and indict me. Right. There we go. There we go. Okay. There to and I guess I just don't, I look at it like, okay, they said that to draw me in, and I still have the choice to either participate in this or just give them lip service and do whatever they like and do this as over someone that's on my side, okay.

1:25:17 And loves me and knows who I am and gives me constructive criticism, I will take that to the fucking bank, I will, I will grow tremendously from it. Okay. All right. I'll, question it at first. Why do you say that? You don't want to know why they're saying what? What? You want to understand the bounds of the criticism.

1:25:32 You want to understand where it came from, and you want to see, you know, you care enough about the person's opinion to further query, to examine. That's right. And then I'll do my analysis of what they said, because I trust that data point is come from someone third person perspective, person that perspective I have myself. They spent that social capital to tell you that.

1:25:53 That's right. Because they love me. Yeah. And tell me that because they want to see me tear them down. They want they want to see me be better. Yes. And legitimately, realistically, they took the risk telling the consultant that comes in and tells me I have an unconscious bias, does not have any investment in you. Exactly. They have an investment in their problem program.

1:26:13 Yeah, possibly moving the needle on a corporate level. That's right. Second degree. Like you said, their program and getting that program continued money. That's right. Now if they if they were bringing this program to the corporate space and they were paying for it with themselves from their own charity fundraising, and if they were actually, paying the company a stipend for the time of the employees, right.

1:26:38 That's a whole totally different thing. It's a level of investment and commitment that we just wouldn't see. Right. So what they're doing instead is they're selling another version of this snake oil witchcraft bullshit, Reiki palm reading nonsense. Okay. Not backed by data, not backed. We're not verifiable. Yeah, they're selling up a panacea. They're selling something that I claim works like a cure all.

1:26:59 Exactly. And it really does. It creates divisions instead of cure. Yeah. I'm glad you finally agree with me. And I've convinced you. I'm glad. No, I mean, it's fucking around. I, I agree with you on certain aspects, but like I said, I know, you see, what I'm saying is different. Yeah. I was like, oh, you're much more open minded to something else than I am.

1:27:21 No, no, you are Sean. I'm not. I'm being dead serious right now. We're trying to say I was that I was just trying to sell my approach, that we can say that there are certain things that I'm close minded to, and there are certain things I'm close minded to. Yeah, but you in general, I think, are more open minded across the board.

1:27:36 But see, when it comes to, skepticism, see, I've closed the door on something until there's a reason to open it. Yeah, because I have to have a focused mind. You need a preponderance of evidence rather than just spreading yourself so thin. Right. And my soul, my mind on that. That's all. I want to get something done in my life.

1:27:54 I have some fucking goals and I want to be of. Right. And if I go down every fucking rabbit hole of Lay's latest craze. Hold this crystal, hold this rod, hold this, hold this. Right, here we go with rods again. You're out of God, you know? You know, here's your chakra. Here's your, you know, all this stuff where there's no data.

1:28:11 No. Guess what I meditate. You know why? Because there's data that the mindfulness that comes through meditation is very productive for you, very healthy for you. It helps your heart. It helps your mind. It helps your quote unquote soul. Yeah. It helps holistically get you more motivated to do what you want. So guess what? I meditate because there's data to says that is valid.

1:28:31 And you want to be a self-actualized cause. There you go. But if someone says, oh, I can see your aura, I'm not going to be, oh, really? How much do I have to pay for you? Tell me what's wrong with me. Yeah, just like the person comes in and says you have an unconscious bias. Oh, really? How much you have to pay to make you make me right?

1:28:46 Not have that unconscious bias? Yeah. Follow me. Yeah. I mean, I get that and, I guess I was just saying, I think we benefit from the idea. Just different tools and different approaches. But let's use the idea. And it's also the hot chick selling the unconscious bias class, everybody to it. And they have these that they use that shtick part of it so that no one's questions it.

1:29:09 That whole thing we talked about originally to bring the conversation full circle. Right? Right. The hot chick, flat earther. Cool. I really enjoyed that conversation. That was really fun.